Vtmb tremere haven. There kinda is, actually. Vtmb tremere haven

 
There kinda is, actuallyVtmb tremere haven  Mailbox bug

Faith Shield Numina for hunters. If I remember well, you can have the Tremere Haven when you finish the Gargoyle quest in Hollywood (if you play Tremere, otherwise it will not unlock for any other clan). Mod Review: Clan Quest Mod [VTMB Main Story Spoilers] Tl; dr: It more than deserves its good reputation. The VTMB version of the popular graphics modifier ENB will probably never be fixed due to the creator focusing on other games like Skyrim. There kinda is, actually. Tremere and Gangrel are cooler. In the Tremere Haven. I like camarilla Malkavians quite a bit better than Tremere. You end up doing what he wanted without getting wiser on who was pulling your strings. There are a few things you need to do in a specific order to get the haven which are easily found by googling about. (message deleted) geohook 15 years ago #2. The Setites have compromised the other one and want to see her take over. The Tremere are somewhat similar in their approach to the procurement of knowledge. I thought the mailbox was in the foyer of the Tremere. Outstar recommended Tremere for the first playthrough and I agree with her choice. The long answer is that any vampire can learn pretty much any discipline, if you're willing to spend the XP for it. It's been a few days and I haven't succeeded after a dozen attemps. I unlocked the Tremere haven, so I thought I'm all set for his ending, but I'm in the cab right now and the only endings that are available for me are Anarch and. Offhand I don't know, but I'm pretty sure it involves being in good relations with the head of said clan (Gary Golden for Nossies, Max Strauss for Tremere) and doing their quests. Apr 26th, 2022. I mostly remember nothing about game other then few…Go to vtmb r/vtmb • by. It's not a terrible problem, but it is a drawback. Weiss. (Image credit: Paradox Interactive) My biggest fear with Bloodlines 2 is that, with its wide variety of clans to play as, including Thinblood, Brujah, Tremere, Toreador, Ventrue and Malkavian. XP Guide (with unofficial plus patch) By jimbobslimbob. Tremere is pretty good for melee combat due to bloodshield and certain ranged combat powers just remember to hit F8 otherwise you violate the masquerade. Limited Dominate in the Plus patch, but the Plus patch isn't. Agreed. A World of. Another didn't get the disc and the quest was failed. Keep obsolete quest items in the haven storage (drawer or footlocker depending on haven) to remove clutter. 20 comments. Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines > General Discussions > Topic Details. Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines > General Discussions > Topic Details. Our sire, for instance, in VTMB would've been off his gourd if you see all the prescription drug bottles and ah . Hi. . Ming Xiao Ming Xiao (明曉, Míng Xiǎo), also known as the Mistress of Mirrors, is a character in . The chantry is the first. Infernal seems better in my opinion. If a Tremere Chantry is trashed/betrayed in some political machination gone wrong or an individual is sent out into the wild and "goes native", you can have members of the Clan who are functionally operating in exile. No, that is surely not the case. Its funny how I talked the Gargoyle into being an ally for the Anarchs Isaac Abrahms and when I went back to Strauss he had no issue with it. Like, I don't think you can ever enter Foxy Boxes unless you have a specific build which opens a dialog option with one character. ; Beard of Evil: He sports a wicked looking goatee and is affiliated with the Sabbat. The Gargoyle (spoiler) beatumdown 3 years ago #1. VTMB: Clan Quest Mod. Type the following commands: If you saved Johansen: SaveJohansen () Then to start level transition if you're anybody but a Nosferatu: changelevel2 la. [Tremere haven, Research > 3] Last edited by R. So: for the male tremere, open the folder in the zip called "vampire", and extract the two folders inside of it to the [. Nosferatu : sewer rat cosplay , backstab everyone you can just because and torture Johansen in a leather suit. However, from a thematic point of view, it does make a lot of sense. Presumably Strauss still becomes the new prince. Games. Vampire: The Masquerade 5th Edition, also known as V5, is the recent version of Vampire: The Masquerade and was released in 2018, with the publication of Vampire:. Strongly recommend playing it at least 4 more times, as Malkavian, Nosferatu, Ventrue and Tremere. It's also 50% off right now. Characters using Dementation, Dominate, or any other mind-altering magic, spell, or Thaumaturgy path against your character are at +3 difficulty. You can farm money if you consistently maintain low masquerade to kill the hunter teams and sell their weapons. They get a unique haven, some unique dialogue with Strauss, and access to thaumataurgy (the 2nd best discipline in the game). Get the game on GoG using my partner link: - t-shirts -. install the "unofficial patch plus" mod if you haven't already. Blood Shield - Absorbs some damage. . I too want to know if this is possible. There is a small timeframe between pressing the button for a discipline and losing blood as the cost. RedWithEnvy1 • 5 mo. Spidersuit90 Jan 1, 2018 @ 5:46am. as a creature of the night, interacting with and battling mortals and other creatures of darkness. A three-front siege on Seattle, a power vacuum in the vampire court and an awakened elder at odds with the voice in their head, realized. I favor the Tremere clan,. I beat it with Tremere, but even with Auspex 5, Dodge 5, Stamina 4 (as Tremere cant have it at 5), and Wits 5, and 3rd Armor, plus Blood Shield, which combined is insane defense in any other mod, I still had to keep playing cat and mouse with even trash mobs in some levels as you die in 2-3 seconds fully buffed any place with bunch of enemies. You'll find Tremere not too different from your current game other than a bit of dialog, your disciplines and your haven. . I recently replayed Bloodlines. Best. 3. Pink is seduction. Honestly, I'm surprised Ventrue didn't get a fancy place due to being the same Clan as LaCroix, however the two unique havens are very proper for the VtM lore while a unique haven for Ventrue besides "rich place" isn't. are entirely up to the player. New Disciplines available from Beckett. I played as a Male Tremere, and if you look closely, I chose the rudest optio. 1. Both the Tremere and the Nosferatu cannot get the Skyeline apartment. There is also a nosferatu specific haven you get after doing some stuff in Chinatown. This may be a boring answer, but I honestly enjoy Santa Monica the most. move the folder "materials" into the UP folder WITHOUT renaming files inside. r/vtmb A chip A chipIf you are playing Tremere, ask Strauss about clan and tell him that you want to join pyramid, help him with plague in Downtown and Gargoyle in Hollywood. With that being said, when you get your Haven and get accepted in the Chantry you are likely to unlock the Tremere clan quest. Ifernal is good, but the cost. Why is she there all of a sudden? Use the computer and check my e-mails, reading the ones from Mitnick about his quest and Gary about the posters. Due to this,. The game plunges players into the dark and gritty vampire underworld of modern day L. They can never raise any physical stat above 4, so I usually don't bother much with those and just concentrate on guns. If it exists, you're meant to use it at some point. Santa Monica Haven. Sallajin • Malkavian • 4 yr. bstodd12 • 3 yr. Clan The clans are the major vampire lineages that comprise vampiric society. Another good pick would be Tremere, imo. I did feel like Blood Strike's damage was starting to get a bit lackluster for a little but the item from the Tremere haven fixed that back to respectable levels. Roughly during the mid-15th century, the Gargoyle Revolt within Clan Tremere begins. Also the place Boris and the plague woman are at is a hotel iirc, not an apartment. The only truly effective weapons against it are your bare hands and the Sledgehammer. Definitely do the gargoyle quest as others have mentioned. 2 comments. Tremere: Tricky one here as I haven't personally experimented with their histories and the tradeoffs seem a touch. The VTMB version of the popular graphics modifier ENB will probably never be fixed due to the creator focusing on other games like Skyrim. or for vtmb + unofficial patch 11. It's not until the sun actually starts to rise over the. Which clan to choose? : r/vtmb. Tories with guns, Brujah with potence and it are the most op. Malkavian and Nos get stealth. I missed one of the (i think) longest secondary quests just because I started It a bit too late in the main story, but it felt quite natural and not as if I were. ago. So you should get along fine with them. Like all bloodlines, each clan has greater familiarity with a set of three Disciplines, a weakness largely unique to its members, and. Also, you can't level your Strength, Dexterity, or Stamina above four (stops at three if you wanna play Final Nights mod, just an fyi). SetQuest("Regent", 5) Then go to Strauss, you'll finish A Plague for Angels like normal and, if. See full list on vtmb. This build focuses on the Tremere clan; while the gender is irrelevant for the build, the Fledgling specifically uses the "Eerie Presence" history. Graphics mods would be my #1 suspect. I think the problem is that the zip files haven't made it easy for you, with different folder structures. If you prefer melee, then Fortitude is helpful for soaking damage and Presence makes enemies less effective against you. Celerity speeds you up, including your brain and reflexes. But, imo, it’s subjective claim. Not both, so once again it's better to invest separately unless if you doing a completionist build which is on you for handicapping yourself. Add a Comment. Good luck and ask if you have issues although I imagine this should fix it up for you. Welcome to /r/VTMB, a subreddit for fans of the original Vampire: The Masquerade Bloodlines game by Troika/Activision Members Online. The other clans might be older than the Tremere, but they haven't put in nearly as much concentrated research time as the Tremere have on the subject. The quest was cut from the game before release, and as such, can only be accessed by using the Unoffical Patch's Plus version. Best. Tell you what, the apartment given to you in the Chantry by Strauss is some pretty sweet digs. Downtown Tremere haven. Blood Theft instead of Blood Salvo. i just finished tremere, which is awesome with the bloodmagic. 19K subscribers Subscribe 6K views 6 years ago VTMB ep13 - Tremere Chantry - quick look Kinda nice suite enjoy. It is their stronghold, laboratory and communal haven. Elder levels of powers like Dementation and Dominate may overwhelm even this resistance. Decided to replay the game after several years, thinking about what characteris better to roll. Aside from that, a few lines of dialogue change but the gameplay is more or less the same. Bubbles the Tremere has a heartache when her Sire decides to bring in a new fledgling. It could be different with the UP tho so just in case use the browse function too, navigate to the UP's executable (should be same folder/patch or something) and select for the . First of all: OMG OMG OMG WESP5 IS IN MY DISCUSSION!!! Second: Thanks for the info. Unless otherwise stated, those without a dot rating usually vary between 1-5 dots. Amaretto213 • 2 yr. Open menu Open navigation Go to Reddit Home. Since the first version, even more new content has been added to the mod, including an additional path midway through the game,. how far into the game are you? i'd use the console to sell those melee + brawl points and put them into firearms perception auspex and thaumaturgy. I'm most of the way through the game, in China town now, on 10. twitter. You can press the alt key and then hold it to run much faster although it seems to be tied to frame rate. He opens it. Horror. A haven is the home or hideout of a Kindred vampire in the Vampire: The Masquerade – Bloodlines game. Characters using Dementation, Dominate, or any other mind-altering magic, spell, or Thaumaturgy path against your character are at +3 difficulty. At creation, the build adds 1 point to Dexterity, 2 points to. Head over to the VTMB 2022 download tab and pick a suitable preset for yourself. blood strike is like having an uzi, remember you can spam it. To unlock the fridge, you need to hack the computer nearby. no crippling weaknesses but no god-like strengths either. Anarch ending for Brujah, Loner ending for the Gangrel, Dancing Werewolf ending for the Malkavian, Kuei-Jin Ending for Toreador, Camarilla ending for the Tremere, LaCroix ending for Ventrue, Nosferatu could go Anarch, Loner or Camarilla. #VampiretheMasquerade #Bloodlines #RPGHello my friends! Today Carline meets her regent and then heads off to the local Anarch bar. Both have their ups and downs. . A Bounty for the Hunter A Severed Arm Blood Pack. The Tremere background "Eldritch Prodigy" and the item in question, as mentioned is the "Daimonori" acquired from the Tremere chantry suite. This is an unofficial SDK for Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines by Psycho-A (and Fire64 and Behar and Wesp5). Sabbat. Has, relatively, a lot of installation options. I. Dead ex +1 XP - Read email in Ground 0. 1. Tremere prefer scholars, academics, intellectuals and occultists, and usually people with a mixture of deference (it won't do to have them chafe against the Tremere Pyramid). Suffer the pangs of Hunger, while navigating undead politics and avoiding deadly hunters. I started with protein 2 and only put points in fortitude. Quitted again, continued the Tremere, but the game itself has been closed many times since and the issue continues on the Tremere. Many websites had their own unique video of the old demo. I couldn't find any references to Max being a Nazi on the White Wolf wiki or the VTMB wiki. Khuei-jin ending - you get betrayed and killed. The freedom of the Anarchs prevents power mongers from controlling others, but makes it harder to protect vampires as a whole. The building separates each apartment by placing it on its own floor, accessible via either the elevator or a ventilation duct that empties into both the kitchen and the bedroom's closet. -oki_ • 1 yr. In the end if you choose the independent ending, you end up in the same situation as with Bertram. It ran at 10-15 fps on most when it was released. It's just that I wanted to know alternative ways that other (more experienced) players built their characters. To leave Strauss, just take a right, then left, then right, then left and you're back at the front entrance hall. Malks have extra content in CQM though, even if some say that it's bad. We say "were" because the Salubri were almost completely wiped out by clan Tremere, who were called "Usurpers" as a result of their actions. Welcome to /r/VTMB, a subreddit for fans of the original Vampire: The Masquerade Bloodlines game by Troika/Activision Members Online Render of a Female Phyre in one of the Tremere Styled OutfitsTzimisce were introduced in the Vampire the Masquerade 5th Edition Companion Guide. The Character Sheet shows the Player's current Character statistics (or 'Stats' as they are more commonly known by). I couldn't tell you about rank 4 and 5, but 1-3 have been working pretty fine for me. Since Tremere politics is cut-throat. I am currently replaying the game again, I've lost count of how many times I've played and just acquired the Tremere Haven. Well I'm going to. Although I used Eerie presence, when I played as tremere. Toreador is the best starting class for first time players due to their 'no extremes' style of play. 10. ; Badass in a Nice Suit: In contrast to lesser Sabbat minions, the Lasombra is dressed quite nicely. Tried to join the sabbat but didn't have the stones to stay for the long haul or B didn't drink from the cup in the frist place for "reasons". Blood Boil is pretty. “As a Tremere in Vampire: The Masquerade – Bloodlines 2, you use your arcane powers to control your own Blood and that of your foes,” reads the official reveal blog post. Tremere: this clan is great for mage types (but also gunslinger types). I just finished my first playthrough of Vampire the Masquerade Bloodlines and it's my all time favorite game now . When they were alive. Go to the game's directory and search for a txt file called clandoc. Their power makes them valuable, but few vampires trust their scheming. I was playing as a social Ventrue and all my points. Obsessed with vitae – or vampire Blood – a drop of blood can become a deadly weapon for the injured, but far from fallen, class. ago. The Tremere is one of my favorite clans. Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines Unofficial Patch. ago. Unarmed: Measures your character's ability to do damage in. tremere are just not meant to melee, and that's ok. Fight your way through a modern-day Seattle on the brink of an open war as an elder Vampire. certain kind of other circumstance that involves a very odd three-way bond, but honestly, it's kind of out there. This may have been a mistake. Idk how to do that, but you can go into the game files and make the game use the same model with every armour. zerosabers • 4 yr. The arcane Clan Tremere were once a house of mortal mages who sought immortality but found only undeath. Yeah, Tremere is a great run. Please note that earlier editions of Vampire: The Masquerade used to define. Hail to. +1 XP - Watch snuff/porn tape with Issac. All Discussions Screenshots Broadcasts Videos News Guides Reviews. In Bloodlines 2, the Tremere use their power to control their. I decided to use the noclip and have some fun exploring, when i thought about get into the tremere haven. A tremere anarch is a bit of a unicorn in the anarch community, most are runaways from the clan who either A. The Tremere’s blood magic comes in two forms. To fix this you will have to use two different console commands. Downtown LA also houses several hotels,. This still doesn't tell me what they DO. Any help would be appreciated. k. 1 zip and copy all the DLL files from the x32 folder and paste them into your game's directory, specifically where Vampire. A three-front siege on Seattle, a power vacuum in the vampire court and an awakened elder at odds with the voice in their head, realized. I know the events in the Hallowbrook Hotel but I'm way before that. Any mods that spawn anything in the game,. After creating the Santa Monica Haven in Freeside, I wondered if creating the Tremere Chantry was doable, as well. You kill Ming Xiao. Tremere Heaven and Skyline apartment : r/vtmb. Fight your way through a modern-day Seattle on the brink of an open war as an elder Vampire. . There are two downtown ones. Yeah, sort of effective and a bit useful but pretty is the main characteristic. In the future, if you wanted it, you have to get the Gargoyle book in the Chantry, talk to Max and persuade him to reveal he's the gargoyle's maker, then kill the gargoyle. He is based all over Los Angeles and is responsible for all the Sabbat efforts in the city. Nos also gets Potence as a back up. Using the console you can actually switch into all of the three hunter classes, who basically work including three Numina when using the UP. When you kill the plague bearers,. . I decided to give it a try and I immediately felt like a kid again. Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines 2. So even if you surround a chantry in a siege, if it looks like you might breach. Sallajin • Malkavian • 4 yr. Talk to Strauss(Tremere Chanty in Hollywood) about the plague before you talk to Damsel. #4. Venture are the best tanks in the game. . The combination of 10 Ranged + 5 Auspex means that you will easily kill all enemies with you high-level guns. He put the Masquerade at risk, made allies of Keui-jin and almost. If you ratted out Max to Issac you pissed Max off and he won't offer it to you either. 3. It all started with the skyline apartments getting flooded with chairs, so it was unusable. you get an awesome haven. Turns out: yes, yes it is- even the looping hallways, thanks to the ineffable Agent Fuse, who let me borrow his scripting from Uncanny Valley Research Center. I started my playthrough in 2018. Lucian7x • 2 yr. I know the events in the Hallowbrook Hotel but I'm way before that. I couldn't find this info anywhere, so I figured it was worth making a post about it. masquerade #ts4 vampires #ts4 vampire the masquerade #Tremere #VTMB #ts4vtmb #the sims 4 #vampire the masquerade bloodlines #vtmb tremere #sims 4 screenshots. 7 if I want Camarilla Edition, and older CQM with PNP and POP's for difficulty. fandom. For how to do the gargoyle mission correctly to get the Tremere haven, check out the previous video. The Tremere are a clan of mages, spellcasters, and warlocks who use magic they learned while living in undeath. Then there's the mods everyone recommends: Clan Quest Mod, The Final Nights Mod, The Prelude Mod, etc. You practically have no problem with blood and your second haven is the best. In layman's terms the Ventrue are dominant while the Toreador enamor. P; Jul 5, 2014 @ 8:43pm #5. I was wondering what clan is the best to role for the most unique dialogue - clan/race-specific, but also dialogue through persuasion and seduction skills. Los Angeles is the second main region and, incidentally, home to the headquarters of the major sects. It's in the Tremere chantry. Tremere and Ventrue are slightly different. Blood Strike - A missile attack that returned some blood. Oddly enough I only remember it coming up against humans. However, outside of Nosferatu and Malkavian, I'd say pick whatever you want to play as. The newly turned vampire must be able to stabilize the Beast within before gaining status. I’m really glad to finally come out of Obfuscate and introduce myself - I'm the new Community Manager for World of Darkness, and I come bearing news about Bloodlines 2 (finally, I know!). Los Angeles is the second main region and, incidentally, home to the headquarters of the major sects. Tremere- Appearance: Great - Very eloquent Ease of Access: Good - Just down the street from central downtown or through the alley from confession Email quests: Great - pretty convenient only have to run up or down 1 flight of stairs for mailbox Items: Great - increase Blood magic damage by 40% kind of broken honestly as Tremere. Go to vtmb r/vtmb • by. However, from a thematic point of view, it does make a lot of sense. Oh yeah I took the money because I looked up the artifact bonus and it seemed absolutely worthless for. Allow them to smear blood on random paintings when they haven't found out which painting it is. I had a lot of fun as a Tremere. That doesn't mean you should never do Toreador or Brujah, but they won't give you much in the way of a unique. 3+. So some locations are permanently closed until you get the. #3. Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines 2 will have a voiced main character: 'it draws the player in that much more', says the game's ex-Bioware narrative designer pcgamer#VampiretheMasquerade #Bloodlines #RPGHello my friends! Today Carline meets her regent and then heads off to the local Anarch bar. She was in the Santa Monica haven when I left last, turned in the gargoyle quest to Strause, unlocked the Tremere haven, Heather is no where to be found. The Daimonori is an occult item in Vampire: The Masquerade – Bloodlines. . Tremere: Thaumaturgy is prety powerfull. It may make your game extremely blurry, however it is still possible to use some features, but SweetFX is. Having said that, I personally would opt for a Tremere whose more of a sucker for knowledge, following the Thaumaturge roots. 0:00 / 1:17 VTMB ep13 - Tremere Chantry - quick look Sclerohouse 1. After the immediate Embracing of a mortal, the victim will become a fledgling. RedWithEnvy1 • 5 mo. So I play CQM 4. You are the Monster. Also, access to a unique Discipline but that's less of a factor. The Nosferatu get a unique sewer haven, the Tremere get that awesome haven in the Tremere magic house, but everyone else gets the same skyline apartment. The Nos haven is in the downtown sewers. The fledgling's computer is located in their haven in Santa Monica, or in the Chantry in Downtown if the protagonist is a Tremere and was accepted into the Chantry. Those are overhaul mods, which of course you should play, but it's not all there is to VtM:B mods. Not much is known about Andrei's background, but it can be assumed that he is a native Eastern European (presumably. So, don't keep that werewolf blood. Their power makes them valuable, but few vampires trust their scheming ways. Green is intimidation. Ch2. Venture are the best tanks in the game. 2) The Diner, as seen and frequently visited in Santa Monica 3) The Tremere Haven, the haven for Tremere Kindred in Downtown, located in the. There's a couple of ways I've seen to tackle "Anarch Tremere". Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines 2 on Twitter Holy Hell. Come end-game, whether you go melee or firearms, is pretty insignificant; you'll still do a shit ton of damage, especially if you chose the right clan. These are the Merits and Flaws available in Vampire: The Masquerade 5th edition. Petrea's Remastered Textures -PRT-is a revamp mod for various NPC facial textures for Vampire: The Masquerade. Go to vtmb r/vtmb • by. Not only did he believe in, but wanted to Diablerise the Antediluvian. Tremere get a different haven, Ventrue have to be picky about who they feed from. Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines 2 has been quietly rebuilt by Dear Esther developer The Chinese Room with 'different gameplay mechanics and RPG systems' - PC Gamer. ago. Nos also gets Potence as a back up. The newest version doesn't work on Linux + wine or M$ Windows(have dual boot) and the older version has not properly implemented the Obtenebration in a good way and i really wanna to play as a Lasombra. I fell for the Tremere after that, Blood strike and shield and you don't need combat skills, though buff is avaliable if needed. Just came to this sub to make a post complaining about my Bloodbuff rank 3 not working correctly when it dawned on me that at character creation, I was told Tremere cannot raise their physical attributes beyond 3. The problem with the Tremere haven is that it's in Elysium, so at the very end you can't go to your haven and reload all your weapons before visiting Mercurio to buy more ammo. You have a, what, 50% chance to vomit up any blood you get from prostitutes or homeless people, and a 100% chance to vomit up rat blood. Add a Comment. Gimble's Prosthetics is a location in . It's my first playthrough of Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines. +3 XP -. That's half the fun. Improved logs, texts, emails, dialogues, descriptions. 3+. The only thing I haven't tried is directly insulting Nines, but that doesn't seem necessary, based on youtube videos. Strongly recommend playing it at least 4 more times, as Malkavian, Nosferatu, Ventrue and Tremere. Mobile havens do work as long as the haven is moved a mile away. The book Thaumaturgical Creature. He's the eldest Tremere we see around. The founder of clan Tremere. It's also 50% off right now. Below follows a comprehensive list of all published Thaumaturgical rituals. Open the console using the tilde "~" key. Traditionally their charges were based on geographical locations, hence the stereotype of a vampire in a looming castle. Also I have no recollection of the diablerie so maybe it's not that significant. Malkavian and Nos get stealth. Vampire: The Masquerade – Bloodlines is a 2004 action role-playing game set in White Wolf's World of Darkness; it was developed by Troika Games and released by Activision for Microsoft Windows. Be aware, you do have to be Camarilla and a Tremere to actually get that haven. The Anarchs are displayed usually as good guys but there are definitely issues with their philosophy. Aside from the ones where you literally/technically die, the anarch ending is the "bad" one, imo. No. Edit: Thank you Wesp, once more you save the day!The quest can bug out, having you stealth through the whole thing and acting normally, but Imalia still gets mad at you when you try to turn it in.